Portland Timbers Player Ratings: Vancouver Away edition
by Ryan Gates on Oct 3, 2011 2:31 PM PDT
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PrintBased on a 1-10 scale:
- Troy Perkins - 7 - Made the two saves we needed and combined with the back four kept the 9th shutout of the season for him
- Eric Brunner - 7 - Once again shut down a good forward and really didn't have any mistakes
- Futty Danso - 7 - Really we can't go wrong with either Futty or Horst alongside Eric Brunner
- Mike Chabala - 6 - Was a great outlet and functioned well within the offense but seemed to get beat too often defensively
What are your ratings?
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The Army was nice and loud,
almost too loud. I had to explain why they were chanting “Your s**t, your white, your gonna lose tonight!” to my 89 year old Grandmother. She thinks we swear too much…
I could put in the PG words for other chants…
I find it interesting that the broadcast seemed to mike the TA and not the Vancouver supporters
I wasn’t there, but from the TV it sounded like the only singing was being done by the TA. That can’t be true, can it? I know it’s a Portland-based broadcast but that’s a little ridiculous.
I watched the TSN broadcast briefly
the sound was of the fans was exactly the same. TA overpowered the mikes.
Jag kom, jag såg, erövrade jag.
Where would this team be without Diego Chara?
He is so good box to box and isn’t afraid to make a challenge. He is definitely going to be missed for the Houston game. Hopefully Captain Jack can get into the offense a little more that game.
RCTID
He is not going to miss the Houston Game
Contributing editor to Stumptown Footy the Portland Timbers SBN blog.
and Yes we would be close to Vancouver.
Contributing editor to Stumptown Footy the Portland Timbers SBN blog.
Singing/crowd level at BC Place
There were Mics around the entire stadium. the reason the TA sounded louder that everything else there is the simple fact that we were.
Its not that the southsiders weren’t singing, we knew they were doing something because we could see their arms moving in pretty decent unison, but their comparative volume is effected by a few realities of their new park.
first of all, in terms of numbers, the Southsiders aren’t what you may be used to at jeld wen, and I would venture to say their size was pretty comparable to our travelling contingent. Couple that with similar participation levels within that group and it means you probably only have a few hundred making all the noise as opposed to the couple thousand of the 3600-4000 in the North End.
On the same note, almost every one of the ~480 travelling TA were at full voice (when not drinking our extremely expensive crappy beer in sippy cups).
Secondly, location of the supporters groups makes a big difference. The Southsiders are down at field level, with a huge expanse of canvas dome looming over their head. I will say the inner dividers that C place has to block off the upper bowl when not in use is a great way to ensure an intimate atmosphere when the reality is that this is a very large venue, capped at 20k seats for the whitecaps.
The traveling group was put up at the top of the lower bowl, with the concrete of the upper bowl above us, creating a directed acoustic amplifier. When the team was warming up to an empty stadium, save the TA, we were litterally hearing the calls of Gleeson, Perkins, and Green/White Army echo back at us from the opposite wall.
The last thing is that, unfortunately, there simply wasn’t a whole lot of crowd involvement. When we would go silent to ask the southsiders sing, not only did we hear little from them, it was almost dead silence. Even the normal crowd noise you expect to hear at any event (ooing and ahhing at the run of play, general hubbub) was scarce to be found.
I think now that they are playing in the heart of downtown the interest and involvement will increase, but though they have had some good numbers at the games, they still have a long way before the city embraces the team to the extent we expect of our cascadian rivals. No fewer than 6 times this weekend I had locals stop to ask about what all these people in green were hear for. “oh the portland timbers soccer team, who are you playing?” seriously, I had to say “your team, the vancouver whitecaps at BC place” a number of times.
Sorry for the long post
by Broken Cowbell on Oct 3, 2011 5:18 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs
Loved the Post Don't worry about length!
That seems to explain a lot. Seems like Seattle and Stumptown have really embraced MLS while Vancouver has gotten more of the Corporate side down.
Contributing editor to Stumptown Footy the Portland Timbers SBN blog.
rivalry talk enabled:
Portland has been embracing the Timbers for a number of years, MLS or not. Seattle embraced MLS and have quickly translated that into success on the pitch as well.
Unfortunately, the USL iteration of the whitecaps, while highly successful on the pitch, played in a small venue in the outskirts of town (burnaby to be precise) and though the Southsiders are very nice folks, they never commanded the sort of respect the TA has, and did not take an active role in the move to MLS, to their detriment. The Whitecaps FO made the business dealings their priority, on field to come after their other ducks are in a row, and never concerned themselves with the atmosphere side of things… and to be fair, and with all due respect to the Whitecaps Supporters who have been there for so long, the bulk of who will be the regular attendees and filling the seats are going to be a whole new set of people from the population density of downtown.
As I said before, now that the team is downtown and people looking for something to do can just walk there, I think the interest will increase. But this season is basically a wash at this point.
in reference to “southsiders would be bigger in whitecaps FO treated them better” – Southsiders would be bigger if they took a proactive role in expanding, were active participants in the preparations for the move to MLS, and made the point that they have a voice that is as fundamental to the whitecaps identity as the waves on their badge… what’s that you say? The Whitecaps changed their historic symbol to refer to the white caps of the mountains now that skiing is popular in whistler and the Southsiders didn’t make a stink at all? oh, I guess that’s another place where they had the opportunity to show that they had an identity that the FO had to give respect to and work with.
I have met many a true Southsider and I really like those guys, but the fact is that they are not analogous with the TA or ECS in terms of being a part of the identity of the club and the atmosphere at the games.
Yup, the Whitecaps FO is all about the business and corporate success – but the Supporters group has done nothing to earn a seat at the table, and they are now playing catch up. Unfortunately, if the city does embrace the team in its new home, the Southsiders may just have learned their lesson too late.
by Broken Cowbell on Oct 3, 2011 6:48 PM PDT up reply actions
Fair Enough
But based on what I’ve read or “heard” (I’m not there so I don’t know for sure) it doesn’t sound like Whitecaps FO was open to giving them a spot at the table even if Southsiders were more active. It’s a shame because while BC Place is very nice the atmosphere was underwhelming from a Whitecap POV.
by yepyou'reright on Oct 3, 2011 7:59 PM PDT via iPhone app up reply actions
Southsiders would be bigger if Whitecaps FO
treated them a little better. While they’re at it they should take Soen out to the woodshed before BC Place is dead silent.
by yepyou'reright on Oct 3, 2011 6:24 PM PDT via iPhone app up reply actions
I can't believe some of the comments
He made and that Cannon made. It is like no one cares and has any pride up there.
Contributing editor to Stumptown Footy the Portland Timbers SBN blog.
For $500 mil on BC Place
They had better start caring or the woodshed will have a line going out the door.
by yepyou'reright on Oct 3, 2011 7:49 PM PDT via iPhone app up reply actions
It's just a different way of marketing the sport, though
The Whitecaps have chosen to market themselves the way a traditional North American sport would – through corporate marketing means rather than through a fan group or groups. It’s not a good thing or a bad thing, it’s just a thing. They have obviously made the calculation that they can succeed as a club doing business that way, and more power to them if they can.
Too much is made of the power of supporters groups in MLS. Very few teams work closely with their large, loyal fan bases (SEA, PDX, PHI are the three that come to mind) and we’re spoiled by that – but it is not the only route to success.
by pdb on Oct 3, 2011 8:08 PM PDT up reply actions
I'll disagree *slightly* on your second point
The success of the “power” of the SG is evident here in Portland. Look back to the beginning of the MLS campaign. The Timbers Army brought awareness to the city that this team was worth supporting. They (I wasn’t a member at the time so I’m not counting myself) came in droves to the “We Are Timbers” shoots and created a buzz, esp. once the billboards showed up.
The experience at the stadium on Opening night in the rain is another. If you compared that match to any of the last 3 home matches there is a huge difference. The entire stadium is involved in the atmosphere now, not just the TA section. The call and answer chants are no longer half of the TA and half of the TA, it’s the TA and the rest of the stadium. Tetris has become iconic with the (poorly named in the media) “Tetris Shuffle”.
The supporters groups of Portland, S**ttle (begrudgingly), and Philly, along with Chicago, Colorado, and coming soon Montreal, have all helped market their teams, not just to the fan base (which is essential, of course), but also to the league itself. This has been commented on all season, now that the full Cascadia phenomenon is in effect AND highlighted by the fiasco in New England, that the traditional “family fun/soccer mom” marketing strategy isn’t cutting it for teams with no “powerful” supporters group(s…after all, S**ttle has 3). The Sons of Ben are one of the major reasons why Philly has a team; they went to local “rival” teams and rooted against them Philly-style and caught the league’s attention. Same thing with Seattle and Portland. The support for their teams (although we all know who had more support in the pre-MLS days) were major reasons behind their teams being given MLS franchises.
Another way of looking at it is that these “powerful” SG’s are reminiscent of the supporters of Euro soccer. By emulating the kind of support a ManU or Arsenal or Chelsea gets, you attract the fans.
In closing, all I am saying is that while there are multiple ways of marketing your team to your fanbase, some teams have looked at what’s worked in other sports’ leagues around the country and tried to emulate that success, and other teams have looked at what’s worked in other countries’ leagues of the same sport and tried to emulate that success. In the end, we’ll see which model works best for our soccer league. But that book is still being written.
Blazers win!
I would add (or perhaps subtract)
that the TA played an instrumental role in an MLS team even being in Portland. It would be hard to imagine corporate sponsors showing up with Merritt at events promoting the mere idea of a team, or packing city hall when the stadium renovation was being considered.
And as much as we denigrate the ECS, remember that Don Garber had to be convinced that this whole rivalry thing was going to carry over into MLS. In 2007, when the announcement was made that Seattle would be an MLS city, the league intended to rename the team, out-with-the-old-in-with-the-new style, convinced that nobody would pay to see a team with the same name as a USL team that only drew 1500 fans per match.
IIRC, the Flounders could easily have been called the Seattle Alliance FC or some crap like that, until the fans demanded a vote on the name. The team created an online ballot with three options (and a write-in), none of which contained the name “Sounders,” so the fans started a write-in campaign to name the team Seattle Sounders. (A few Timbers fans might have stuffed the ballot box.) In the end, the FO gave in (sort of) and called the team Seattle Sounders FC.
The supporters groups made this. They preserved a rivalry and fed it, and two of the Cascadia FOs understand that.
When I write, I write for the Timbers. Contributing Editor of Stumptown Footy
by Andrew Wheeler on Oct 3, 2011 9:51 PM PDT up reply actions
I'll admit, I did vote "other" for Seattle.
It would have been a travesty otherwise.
Jag kom, jag såg, erövrade jag.
I guess my second point was worded poorly
I do not doubt for a minute that ECS and the Timbers Army played a great role in the formation and development of both cities’ MLS teams. I saw it happen in both cities. And it also happened with the Sons of Ben in Philly as well. What I meant was that those three seem to be the exception, not the rule. Almost all teams have supporters groups, most teams seem to listen to them, but that’s where the interaction ends – most teams listen to their groups, say “thanks for your input”, and call it good. Those of us in the NW sometimes forget that because we do have such amazing support here and automatically think “that’s the way it has to be done”.
Not every city has that level of supporters group culture, not every city wants that, and Vancouver seems OK with building their support in a different way. That was all I was trying to get across.
by pdb on Oct 4, 2011 6:59 AM PDT up reply actions
I think I agree with you
But I think I was saying that at least in the case of Portland, coordinating with the supporters groups pretty much was the way it had to be done.
Portland doesn’t have as much corporate presence as other MLS cities, it has a smaller population than most of the other cities, and it doesn’t have the large foreign-born-with-disposable-income population that some of the other cities can rely on. The case Merritt made to the league, the city, corporate sponsors, his dad, etc, that the Timbers were going to be a viable product was bolstered by the supporters group being a part of that product.
So yeah, I agree that supporters group coordination isn’t required in most MLS cities. But I think it would have been really hard for Portland to have been so successful without it.
When I write, I write for the Timbers. Contributing Editor of Stumptown Footy
by Andrew Wheeler on Oct 4, 2011 9:20 AM PDT up reply actions
True but the initial comment was about Vancouver's lack of said supporter commitment
we kinda went off the rails a bit, but my original point was that Vancouver can succeed without the intensive level of supporter group involvement that Portland/Seattle/Philly have had. It’s just a different way of doing business.
by pdb on Oct 4, 2011 9:23 AM PDT up reply actions
Yes, absolutely.
Vancouver still sucks. :)
When I write, I write for the Timbers. Contributing Editor of Stumptown Footy
by Andrew Wheeler on Oct 4, 2011 9:49 AM PDT up reply actions
Agreed..
But even if it’s not required in most cities, it’s almost all up-side. By working with supporters groups the clubs may lose a tiny bit of control, but they essentially gain a large, positive, free marketing arm.
Supporters groups have the unique ability to make following the team appeal strongly to certain demographics in a way that putting adds on TV can’t. There’s just not much down-side here.
Well, the TA is pretty exceptional too
Most supporters groups aren’t as well organized or as positive as the TA is right now. A well intentioned club may rightly not want to work with a poorly organized or negatively minded group.
When I write, I write for the Timbers. Contributing Editor of Stumptown Footy
by Andrew Wheeler on Oct 4, 2011 10:14 AM PDT up reply actions
What I really want to know
is why everyone insisted on doing Tetris backwards. Isn’t it always right then left? Or do some sections do it the other way around? Everyone in my row was baffled by this, but we eventually just gave up and went with the flow!
At JWP it has to be right then left because 101 can't go left
by pdb on Oct 4, 2011 9:24 AM PDT up reply actions
Sure....
but I’d have thought everyone would keep doing it that way. Unless we just wanted to mix it up cause we can! :-)
Situational Awareness
At JWF 101 can’t go left so we start by going right. At San Jose we were abutted against a railing with nothing to our right, so we started left. At BC place there was a concrete wall and then tarped over seats to our right, so we started left (where there was only an aisle before a tarped over section).
Nothing is stone, everything can and must be adapted
by Broken Cowbell on Oct 4, 2011 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions
Thank you
I was right in the middle, and from there it didn’t look like there were obstructions in either direction.
Not sure I see much point in the Dike substitution
Maybe if he was the kind of guy who could dribble it into the corner and hold the ball up for a while. Maybe put in Wallace and move Zizzo up or something. Fresh legs up top is great I guess. But with a few minutes to play, what’s the point?
As the OP suggests, at least the other subs weren’t made too late as Spencer often seems to do.
volatilelyle.com
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