The Lumberyard: New Guy Edition
by William Duke on Aug 23, 2011 8:30 AM PDT
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PrintHey folks, I'm going to be helping out around the website as the new "Social/Community Manager". What this aforementioned title basically means is that I'll be leading efforts to increase Stumptown Footy's presence in the community (think more watch-parties at bars, meet-ups, etc.) and shying away from more of the hard analysis that is so capably handled already around here. I'm looking forward to my time on this website, and hopefully I can add something to the community here.
Anyway, on to the Lumberyard!
So I've been anxiously brainstorming ideas and researching the previous Lumberyards all day for ideas of how I'm going to go about my first post, and I've come to the conclusion that the soccer-oriented Lumberyards have gotten more comments (this being a Timbers blog, who are in fact, a professional soccer team) than the non-soccer Lumberyards. HOWEVER, since I get to ask for a reaction to more than one topic I posit these two questions:
1) Youth development in the United States is far different from the youth development in Europe, with the US using collegiate programs (go Cocks) and European clubs starting far earlier. Will the rise of soccer's popularity in the US, as well as the MLS "Homegrown Player" policy lead to the death of NCAA men's soccer, or will the opposite fate await college soccer? Discuss!
2) "Timbers Bacon." I was purchasing a beer (modestly priced at $8.50) on Saturday night when I noticed "Timbers Bacon" for the first time. I hadn't noticed it before Saturday, but has anybody actually eaten the chocolate-covered bacon with green, gold, and white frosting on it? Personally I couldn't think of a better snack to settle your beer-sloshed stomach in 90-degree heat than chocolate and pork fat...Discuss?
Da Rules:
The Lumberyard is here to give the entire site a place for true non-soccer conversation and random thoughts. Its purpose: A place where people can come and chat about all the stuff that doesn't fit in with the rest of the site, and even be loose in terms of byplay and humor. The goal of the Lumberyard is to foster c
ommunity; to let people get to know each other outside of the everyday front page posts. There will be happy ones, sad ones, ones like a sharing circle, and ones like an open mike night at the comedy club. In the Lumberyard, people really have a chance to become a family.
So, if you have a one-off thought, post it in here. The rules are basic, and are as follows:
- Ad hominem (personal) attacks will never be tolerated.
- Everything you write is visible publicly, so be careful.
- Don't use the Lumberyard to call out or talk about users from other threads on Stumptown Footy.
- Remember that every image posted will slow the thread down, so try to post as few as possible. Posting a link to an image you want to share is an acceptable alternative, and thus can share as many images as you wish without slowing down the thread. If you do post an image in the thread, please post something in the subject line so that the image stays mimimized.
- Most importantly, HAVE FUN!!!
- Please go easy on the new dude.
Alright guys, I don't believe I have to say this but, just in case, please do not submit anything racist, homophobic, sexist or otherwise not appropriate for even the younger Timbers fans.
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A few thoughts
1. Sure, I’m as much of a Timbers fan as the next guy, but Timbers Bacon sounds disgusting.
2. Regarding the NCAA question, I’d be interested to find out the ratio between top flight American High School players that go to college vs playing pro MLS vs playing pro in Europe/Overseas, and what kind of relative success they experience
3. I really hope you’re a South Carolina fan, :)
Say it ain't Cho
by Sean in Vancouver on Aug 22, 2011 7:40 PM PDT reply actions
I'm a proud alumnus of the University of South Carolina
Well, between Scotch and nothin', I suppose I'd take Scotch. It's the nearest thing to good moonshine I can find.- William Faulkner
by William Duke on Aug 22, 2011 9:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Where do the top young American players play?
Looking at the players who received multiple call-ups to the US U20 team last cycle, the breakdown seems to be roughly:
~15% grew up overseas. (Most of these were eligible for the US due to having American parents. There are a lot of kid in Germany whose fathers were in the US military.)
~40% grew up in the US and moved to Europe or Mexico to become professional soccer players. Some of these players left when they turned 18, though the ones that had EU or Mexican passports generally left at much younger ages. Less than 20% of these players played any college soccer before going overseas.
~45% ended up playing in MLS. Around half of these players played in college before joining MLS, though they generally only played 1 or 2 years of college soccer.
So overall you have around 60% of the top players who grow up in the US going to college, with most of them staying in college less than 2 years.
#1 rule of the 21st Century, If you want to know something, ask a message board
Great info. So you have a majority of top players going to college, but (similar to basketball) most don’t stay very long. Seems to me like the system works pretty well domesitcally.
I am definitely far less qualified than most on this board to comment on this, but in my opinion, the problem with the system, in relation to the rest of the world, is accessibility. Its very similar to tennis and golf in that respect.
Lets say you’re the proud parent of an obviously athletic 8 year old. You can spend (a rough guess) $100 to sign him up for a season of Pop Warner football, or a summer basketball league, take them to a few practices a week, and across town for a game on the weekend. Or, you can pay significantly more to sign them up for a soccer club, and spend more money traveling around to camps and tournaments in order to give them the highest level of training and competition. Of course, Tennis and Golf require way more money than any of the above, normally memberships to pricey clubs, and private coaching. Which is probably why soccer is growing in America, while Tennis and Golf are being surpassed by the international community.
Also, if I’m off base on this assertion, please correct me, because I want to know if I’m being an ignorant ass.
Say it ain't Cho
by Sean in Vancouver on Aug 24, 2011 11:38 PM PDT up reply actions
Bacon
I actually had that bacon at the Seattle game for the Press food. Wasn’t too bad at all.
Having played through the youth leagues you are mentioning I know for a fact that the coaching can be terrible. Also we don’t play enough games. If a player were to play only Classic soccer (the competitive leagues) they would only play 12-15 games in league play in the fall and only practice twice a week for 2 hours. This would end in October or November and you wouldn’t play again until spring if you are lucky. Then you have 3 tournaments in the summer and that is it. So at most 25-35 games of competition a year with maybe 100 total practices, which is not even close to what they would be getting in Europe.
Contributing editor to Stumptown Footy the Portland Timbers SBN blog.
Great points...
…about the lack of PT and quality coaching, I think that’s something that should come with time though, hopefully.
Press box chocolate bacon I can see, but condensation-soaked, hot weather bacon is a different beast.
Well, between Scotch and nothin', I suppose I'd take Scotch. It's the nearest thing to good moonshine I can find.- William Faulkner
by William Duke on Aug 22, 2011 9:14 PM PDT up reply actions
25-35 competitive games a year seems reasonable.
It’s the amount and quality of practice time that is the bigger problem, along with the fact that American kids aren’t doing as much self-directed training and pick-up games. By the time elite American players get to college, they are already way behind their European and South American counterparts when it comes to technical ability.
Chocolate covered bacon is much better in theory than in practice, I've found
I don’t know a damn thing about youth soccer, but I like bacon.
Chocolate covered bacon not doing it for you?
Try candied bacon. It is like delicious compressed doom. It takes a day off your life for each bite you take, but each bite you take is like living ten lifetimes of tasting wonder.
Or something.
http://www.foodnetwork.com/recipes/emeril-lagasse/cayenne-candied-bacon-recipe/index.html
by William Conwell on Aug 23, 2011 9:01 AM PDT up reply actions
We still need collegiate soccer
to scout this country for talent. We don’t have the soccer infrastructure to find talent in many portions of this country. D2 teams do not do this, and MLS is only in 15 American cities. That said, it is a terrible “pay-to-play” system to find talent. If MLS clubs can get down to around age 14 with teams that don’t require the teens to pay and be in more locations than where they reside, then all the better. [RSL has a year round facility in Arizona for instance] At the moment, the MLS youth system is not big enough to take the place of colleges or help advance US soccer.
Bacon? mmmmmmmm. That’s a sometimes food.
Jag kom, jag såg, erövrade jag.
I got this picture on my desk at work, but with someone photoshopping angry eyes and he says
“What the hell is this crap?”
Blazers win!
Haha
Yeah, when I copy and pasted DA RULES it autofilled a #6, so I added one; it won’t stay the whole time.
Well, between Scotch and nothin', I suppose I'd take Scotch. It's the nearest thing to good moonshine I can find.- William Faulkner
by William Duke on Aug 22, 2011 9:54 PM PDT up reply actions
Academies
Development academies by MLS teams will absolutely be the foundation imo. Some kids will still go to college from them, but give the academies 10 years, and I would be willing to bet that 75% of the domestic players at a minimum will come through that system. In most cases, it will get the kids better coaching, in a more competitive and professional environment, with better support for the players. Given MLS is allowing teams to expand beyond their territory borders to look for talent in satellite academies, I’m sure eventually we’ll see them everywhere. In fact, I’m disappointed by our own efforts this year (and the fact the Timbers chose OYSA instead of OPL to partner with, given it seems all the best players are with OPL) . I wouldn’t mind us hiring a more experienced GM and have GW drop down and focus exclusively on youth development, something I think he’s better at.
What effect do you think this will have on the national team?
Do you think it would be helpful to have a ‘national philosophy’ when it comes to training etc?
Aut disce, aut discede; manet sors tertia, caedi
oops. should be a reply to zaggy
Aut disce, aut discede; manet sors tertia, caedi
by Occam's Blazer on Aug 23, 2011 8:58 AM PDT up reply actions
Nope
I think there’s nothing wrong with that, but how can you conceivably push all teams to develop players in a certain mold. What mold would that even be? South American? African? Total Football? EPL? German? Spanish?
We’re such a melting pot, with so many different kids from such different backgrounds, I think you’d be hard pressed to put all of them into a certain “style”. Now, that said, looking at the academy at Braedenton, I could see them emphasizing certain tactics there, but yeah, in terms of a truly “national identity” ala Dutch and their total football, I’d frankly have a hard time seeing that happen across all MLS academies. Just too many players, from such different backgrounds, whose strong suits can be anywhere across the board.
The biggest thing to me though, is legitimate academies, along with real opportunities in MLS, could really start to steer some of the best athletes (Chad Ocho-cinco?) to stay with soccer, rather than give it up in HS to concentrate on soccer or basketball. We start getting players like that in academies at a younger age, giving them more time and better competition to play against, that’s when the US will really compete for a WC.
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